Remember kids, Tankies wants to undermine democracy - same as facists.
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Hey everyone, just a reminder:
- Yes Nazis are also bad, we don’t have Nazis pop up anywhere near as often as Tankies
- We remove and ban Nazis too
- We’re aware of Lemmy’s main code writers being ML’s, and it’s not great.
- Please report any bigot bullshit, or fascist/tankie dogwhistles.
Kick Zionists out of 196
What’s your issue with Yitzhak Rabin? With the Israeli Labour party in general? I mean short of any issues you might have with socdems in theory or practice.
I am opposed to the continued bombing of Palestine, as well as apartheids and genocides.
And Herzl advocated for which of those?
Rabin was a Labour Zionist killed by a Religious Zionist. It’s not a left-right thing. In fact it would hardly be accurate to call the right’s conception of Zionism proper Zionism as a Jewish state in perpetual conflict with its neigbours is not feasible in the long term. Right wing and self-sabotage, name a more iconic duo.
I’m not here to debate the definition of Zionism.
I’m here to post images and links of Palestine’s casualties. I’m not sure what your getting at above. I feel like your trying to distract from the current situation. Which is this: Israeli bombs continue to drop on Gaza.
If you use a word in a wrong way then you shouldn’t be surprised if people call you out on it.
And, no, I won’t excuse Israel here there’s fucking Kahanites in the current government, Rabin’s killer is a Kahanite, they’re not a single bit less fascist than Hamas or Nazis, just the coat of paint differs.
…and maybe, just maybe, if you’re out here on the internet with the explicit mission of doing activism you should have an understanding about the broader political context of things, the alternative is to be an instrument for whoever gets to you first. This is basic shit. In a sense Zionism dates back to about 500BC when Persians conquered the area from the Babylonians which had conquered the Jewish kingdoms and ethnically cleansed them.
The return to Israel was back then tied up with a prophecy of world peace (see swords to ploughs), but the diaspora continued to exist and there’s in fact anti-Zionist Jews who think that the whole project is heresy as it’s trying to force a prophecy. Zionists of course disagree (or simply don’t see it in religious terms), but long story short yes there’s plenty of people who want a Jewish state, with full rights for all non-Jews living there, democratic, liberal, peaceful, lefty, all the things. Rabin was one of them. Herzl wasn’t that much different. You should be supporting those people, try to convince Israelis to give that approach another chance, not lump them up with genocidal maniacs. Same of course goes for the Palestinian side (in case you plan on defending Hamas).
tl;dr: Fascism bad.
Once again. I don’t know what your getting at.
Let’s stop dropping bomb on Gaza and figure out the rest later.
Anytime you say “palestinians are dying” there’s always a well-trodden wag going “ARE YOU SAYING ISRAEL SHOULDN’T EXIST11???///!!”
You have to learn to just ignore it and hope the world will come to some sense at some point soon
To quickly get the IDF to stop bombing getting rid of the current government seems to be a decent approach, don’t you think? To that end, I’ll quote myself:
You should be supporting those people, try to convince Israelis to give that approach another chance, not lump them up with genocidal maniacs.
Zionism in general needs to die, you’re just repeating the same shit over and over
Social democrats are still imperialist.
wouldn’t that make you a nazi
These threads are odd to me, considering how many people call all communists tankies. The word seems to be used by anarchists, conservatives, communists, anti-communists, and more, and every person has a slightly different definition.
Half the people here could consider the other half to be the tankies everyone is mad at.
To be clear this isn’t me saying “be nice to the tankies” this is me saying “the overuse of this word is confusing the shit out of me.”
Maybe it’s just the circles I run in, but I understand “tankie” to mean leftists who think Soviet/Maoist/vanguard-party styles of Communist revolution/rule were good, actually, to the point of denying any bad things they did/do as “Western propaganda”.
Given the red scare in the US, our ability as a whole to use any sort of leftist political labels accurately across the population is basically non-existent, so I do understand the frustration by both tankies and non-tankie leftists about how the term gets used lately, especially in produce circles on social media.
But again maybe that’s just me. I don’t know if I would consider myself a communist, but I do consider myself as a yet undetermined variety of socialist, if that helps at all.
…because none of those groups are Tankies and they are all unified against Tankies.
Tankies aren’t socialists or communists (not that those two things are the same either). They are the purist ideologues of communism, where compromise is defeat. Rampant in telling you why you’re wrong, and why only the purest form of communism will bring nirvana. All without understanding the consequences of what they propose.
Even the Communists don’t want them on their side.
I think you kinda missed my point. Sure, socialists and communists don’t like tankies, but conservatives think the socialists and communists who don’t like tankies are tankies. They aren’t “unified against tankies”, they don’t agree who, what, and where “tankies” are.
Tankies aren’t socialists or communists (not that those two things are the same either). They are the purist ideologues of communism, where compromise is defeat.
They literally support a transitionary period and a capture of the bourgeois state for the interests of the proletariat instead of its immediate dissolution, compromise is the thing ultralefts criticize them for.
“Damned Scots! They ruined Scotland!”
Then there’s folks like me who have no idea what the term means, you’re not alone in your confusion.
Edit: thanks for all the replies folks! TIL
Tankies are ‘communists’ ala Mao and Stalin, i.e. okay with the violent opression of democratic movements and minorities.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://piped.video/LcJ5NrJtQ8g?si=mOa-prQldsGdK7s4
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
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Anyone who supports the idea of communism isn’t very intelligent to begin with.
Anyone who makes a wack generic statement like that can’t be particularly “intelligent” either
Communists seem to be sad, pathetic people now. I thought ya’ll had something, but you’re all just a bunch of fractured apologists trying to get one over on each other.
Sad, ya’ll actually had something going on at one point, now you’re just irrelevant
I can’t tell if you are just angry and on a weird internet tantrum or a communist who made this account to do a bit
Strong probability the name is a reference to catradora_stalinism, a prominent monarchist user on Hexbear. Not sure if it’s an alt or someone who really hates C_S.
Can’t tell if you’re just outta anything smart to say or just want me to confirm whatever little paranoia you got
I can’t tell why you commented on a day old comment to start an argument with someone who doesn’t really care that much.
I can’t tell why someone who doesn’t care all that much wants to keep replying to me
I mean I don’t really care about the topic you are speaking about
But I am bored
But I am bored
honestly mood
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It became confusing when liberals learnt of the word - now they hurl the word at anyone who dares to remind them that being pro-capitalist is still a right-wing thing to be.
Capital co-opting and perversing anticapitalist rhetoric to its own benefit, in my Lemmy? It’s more likely than you think.
I’m an anarchist, we don’t call anybody tankies. Tankies is a term coming from the UK i think the 80s some eastern european nation was taken over by the USSR and some Brittish came out in support of it. So they were called tankies.
These political fighting words need to be layed to rest. Communists hate me as much as anybody else but I’d rather engage on the idea level instead of ad hominem attacks and name calling.
I suspect this whole tankie thing might be a coordinated propaganda campaign geared at discrediting communists and at the same time creating tension between them and other leftits. I suspect this as this whole infighting over small differences doesn’t lead to a victory for the left but effectively disables and neutralizes it.
I’m an anarchist, we don’t call anybody tankies.
Speak for yourself… anarchists are very prone to using that term to describe the technocratic left. I know, I’m one of them.
I think most of you need to worry way less about sounding sufficiently the “right kind” of leftist and focus more on promoting leftism through action. More than half the “tankie” discourse is, at best, a needless distraction from actual progress. Lose your buzzwords and stop the ideological purity pissing contest and actually put in the work in your communities instead, goddamn.
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The Soviet Union did not kill all those nazis out of the goodness of their hearts, but rather because they were in active warfare with Nazi Germany and thus needed to kill a large number of nazis to win the war. Throughout history, authoritarian “socialists” have backstabbed, betrayed, and otherwise killed anarchists and democratic socialists. I absolutely do not trust tankies to fight against fascism in the United States or Europe in any effective manner. Russia and China are not friendly countries to queer rights, though being gay is legal in both countries they do not have any anti-discrimination laws that apply to queer people and the reason there are fewer hate crimes is simply because they don’t count them. Russia and China are also not socialist, Russia is an explicitly oligarchical capitalist Presidential republic and China has a mixed economy that heavily relies on markets with private owners. This is honestly a good part of the reason I’m suspicious of tankies, the United States sucks but that doesn’t mean that every nation that opposes the United States is automatically good.
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From what I can tell, China has a low rate of hate crimes against queer people in general, though the culture still has issues with enforcing conservative gender roles (as does basically everywhere else, this isn’t a China-specific problem). For happiness, the data I could find generally pointed to the United States being happier, but I think that measuring such a thing is difficult and rife with systemic issues (Source). China has significantly better homeownership statistics than the United States, I agree with you on that. The United States and China seem to have a comparable number of doctors per capita, with the United States having significantly more nurses. Healthcare in the United States is significantly more expensive, though I think that’s a somewhat unfair comparison as the United States is uniquely bad in this regard; there are other nations with similar political and economic systems to the United States with significantly better healthcare.
I think saying that Biden is failing is an overstatement. Biden has made very unethical decisions regarding Israel in recent times but has also been a very pro-labor president, his NLRB has been possibly one of the most pro-union iterations of the institution in its history. Biden’s approval rating is poor, but that’s typical of modern U.S. presidents. In terms of the general election Biden is polling fairly evenly with Trump, but this far out from the election that could change drastically, and Trump himself is drowning in legal issues that are drastically reducing his ability to campaign. I’m not sure how the 2024 election is going to go, but I think Biden has a decent chance.
A mixed economy is viable, in fact, it’s probably the best type of economy. Most nations that are economically successful have mixed economies. My main problem is that China claims to be a socialist economy when it is not. China has private companies, which are owned by a private owning class. China has a stock market with major stock exchanges, and though its government exercises greater control over private interests it still has private interests. An economy that would at least be far closer to socialism would be one where private ownership of corporations was illegal, all corporations would either be employee-owned or state-owned and within employee-owned corporations, there would be regular elections to determine upper management and to make important decisions. There are other models of how to build a socialist economy, but none of them involve private ownership of economic structures. Beyond the non-socialism of the economy, I also believe that China is not a proper democracy. The only roles that are directly elected by the Chinese people are local legislators, who then vote for the legislators above them and so on. I am strongly against this form of democracy, as it leads to enough abstraction that by the time you reach the national legislator there is a strong chance the local people don’t even know the people being elected. In my preferred model for a representative democracy, the voters vote for every level of the legislature.
The Soviet Union also invaded a democratic nation alongside the Nazis, proceeding to then steal half that country’s land and murdering a large number of ‘undesirables’.
Tankies and the soviet union aren’t the same thing though.
I mean, the term literally originates as a label for British socialists/communists that were sympathetic to the USSR when they were invading Hungary (pretty sure it was Hungary?)
defining the USSR in this way (by acts performed under specific leaders) is like defining the USA based on Reaganism or Nixonism or Bushism
I think you have misunderstood my comment in some way.
Red army also raped more women and children than any other in our written history. Just because they helped clean up some shit in Europe doesn’t make them good guys
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Because there are overwhelmingly more tankies than nazis on Lemmy. Most of the rightwingers moved to nostr or whatever after exploding-heads was defederated everywhere and eventually closed down. The Nazis that are left get heavily downvoted, reported and banned pretty quickly. Or are still on/back to reddit. Not saying they aren’t here but they are a LOT less vocal and represented than the ultra-left crowd from hexbear and lemmygrad.
The Fediverse in general is pretty much on the left of the political spectrum. Show me one “conservative” community that is active and where posts aren’t all negative
This might be divisive, but kick Nazis out of everywhere.
For real nazi scum fuck off
Oh look Nazi propaganda. I’ve yet to see anything indicating the red army was exceptionally bad compared to other armies in this regard.
If by “fight by our side” you mean sell us out to the Kremlin or the CCP, sure.
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Also over a million Uighurs in prison camps.
Based on a survey done of four people by literally a German fascist who believes God gave him a mission to destroy China, sure.
In China it’s also illegal for gay couples to marry and adopt; stop pretending like you care about LGBTQ rights.
In China it’s also illegal for gay couples to marry and adopt
Most American states only legalized same-sex marriage and adoption in the 2010s. Like America, China has socially conservative older generations and socially progressive younger generations. The country and its people are not monolithic, they’re not some alien land where people are fundamentally different from here. Support for marriage equality is widespread and rising in China, they appear to be on the same track as America.
stop pretending like you care about LGBTQ rights
Stop making paranoid assumptions about people. How is anyone supposed to communicate when that is the dynamic?
It’s really simple, stop cherry picking bits of information to try to make any one country look good. Don’t be a propagandist. Be aggressively critical of America and China for every single way in which they oppress LGBTQ people.
Honest question: What is a tier 1 city?
Cities in China are ranked in terms of population and overall prosperity. So Beijing, Shenzen, Shanghai and maybe some others are tier 1. Then other ones, like perhaps Tianjin and Wuhan would be tier 2 etc. I think India has a similar system, probably because they both have at least one or two hundred cities each
the Soviet army killed more Nazis than any other in history
Nah, actually Hitler killed more Nazis than anyone else in history, including Hitler.
Believe it or not, fascists also kill fascists.
It’s funny that everyone is up in arms about this post but the literal sticky post says no tankies
Eh this argues that we even have a democracy that is functional enough to undermine in the first place, and I reject that premise.
what democracy?
Multivariate analysis indicates that economic elites and organized groups representing business interests have substantial independent impacts on U.S. government policy, while average citizens and mass-based interest groups have little or no independent influence.
[…]
In the United States, our findings indicate, the majority does not rule — at least not in the causal sense of actually determining policy outcomes. When a majority of citizens disagrees with economic elites and/or with organized interests, they generally lose. Moreover, because of the strong status quo bias built into the U.S. political system, even when fairly large majorities of Americans favor policy change, they generally do not get it.
something like 70% of Americans want universal healthcare and yet it remains politically impossible.
Bro what, if we can stop leftist infighting for one fucking minute that would be great. We all have 90% of the same goals so how about we work on that and not build artificial walls to those to the left of us. Also being pro western „democracy“ is cringe.
Loving to see tankies come out of the woodwork to seethe and troll at this
I’m not sure anyone knows what a tankie is.
Apparently saying any country other than the US should take a turn at world leadership is a tankie opinion.
Hexbear disliked that
I think we should consider the feelings of Hexbear users when posting or commenting.
If you think they’ll dislike it, it’s probably a good post.
Hexbear REALLY dislikes my compilation of their queerphobia at !dronerights@lemm.ee
I mentioned the time hexbear’s admin called the (trans) admin of blahaj.zone (the trans instance) “transphobic” in another thread once. Some hexbear dipshit then “named and shamed” me as a transphobe.
They’re loud, obnoxious idiots – nothing more.
I wonder if it’s the same hexbear admin who banned me from the entire site after I called them on being in support of crypto, then made a post-hoc justification for. You know, that sham right wing capitalism alternative that pedos use to buy illegal material with.
Regardless, I made a comment saying “Stop working, ‘work will set you free’ is a nazi phrase” and they removed it for “Godwins Law” so obviously I’m not missing out because I have literally never seen anyone outside of a nazi misuse Godwin’s Law that egregiously.
this sounds weird to me because to my knowledge hexbear hates crypto, I feel like I’m missing context
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Posting history is public too and gives a more clear picture of what was happening.
the user you are replying to was banned for transphobia, they were dismissing the existence of enbys as their own gender. They’re an insane troll.
Enbies are not our own gender. We are thousands of genders.
Hexbear is full of transphobic trans people and Blahaj’s admin is also a transphobic trans person.
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DroneRights (me) was banned for saying gender neutral pronouns exist. Because Hexbear thinks gender neutral pronouns are transphobic.
no you’re making shit up, look at the goddamn modlog
Removed Comment “They” is a non gendering pronoun. If you use they/them, you’ll never misgender anyone, but you’ll also never gender anyone correctly either. Some people are okay with not being gendered and some people aren’t. You should respect their wishes once you’ve heard them, but I don’t believe you have any obligation to check them in advance.
by DroneRights [it/its] reason: enbyphobiaThis is pretty unambiguously a log of me saying gender neutral pronouns exist and the admins taking issue with that.
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As for the pictures you have of me on Blahaj, they are perfectly accurate summaries of my views on Ada. Yes, you are 100% correct that Ada banned me for daring to disagree with her and to call out her transphobic behaviour.
As for Hexbear you are 100% incorrect about my views. I do not they/them anyone I know to have a different pronoun preference, and indeed you’ve taken a screenshot of me saying that you can’t gender someone correctly with they/them. You will find many instances of me referring to people with their chosen pronouns on !dronerights@lemm.ee . Your misrepresentation of my views is slander, entirely unbased in fact and directly contradicted by the evidence that you yourself provided. If you are not lying on purpose, then I have the deepest sympathies for the teacher who tried to teach you reading comprehension.
Good
they don’t have the ability to dislike, they removed the downvotes (i think) lmao
who is hexbear
A website on the fediverse for transphobic stalinists
Do you have nothing better to post?
Agree, but to me they’re no different from any other genocide denying pieces of shit. If you are a NATO apologist that sees what happened to Iraq or what is currently happening to Gaza as any less abhorrent, you are just as bad as someone apologizing for Russia or the USSR.
The economically motivated NATO intervention in Libya was justified with false claims of a genocide. This was the conclusion reached by the British parliament report. Now Libya is a war-torn failed state with open-air slave markets. That intervention was less than a decade after “Iraq has WMDs,” a lie that has killed over a million people. When we have all witnessed these events in our lifetimes, I think we should be a little skeptical when enemy states are vilified. I don’t know if public backlash could have prevented the intervention in Libya, but I hope we’ll at least try to prevent the next one.
Am I an apologist if I say, “It’s okay for them to exist, they just need to stop doing bad things”?
How the hell did commies just become pro capitalist?
I don’t follow whatever your reasoning is here.
so capitalist alliances are good now?
I said, “It’s okay for them to exist, they just need to stop doing bad things”.
That could mean, “it’s okay for capitalist countries to exist, they just need to stop doing bad things”, as easily as it could mean, “it’s okay for communist countries to exist, they just need to stop doing bad things”.
capitalist countries are different than commie ones, thats the whole point
Would you give communist countries a free pass to commit genocides, war crimes, and human rights violations, just because they are communist?
Only difference is in magnitude. Authoritarian countries are remarkably efficient at killing huge numbers of people.
I wonder where all the native americans went
Mostly killed by diseases they had no immunity to, but it was greatly exacerbated by terrible conditions in reservations due to corruption and malice, and hard forced relocations.
